Here are some ideas, I will impart, that I just thought of right now. A big problem of people posting in the wrong forum maybe could be solved. Maybe it could be the structure of goth.net forums in general. Maybe if we put the general boards and such on the top and then the Goth.net help and questions and such below it, it would get rid of a bit of confusion and might help. Just some more ideas. Because when you see: suggestions at goth.net, it could mislead people possibly.

Same with the FAQ...because on seeing the FAQ, you might see at first just problems and such. Of course since I have a tendency to scroll down I saw the "What is goth?" sections and such. Maybe the "What is goth?" section should be brought to the top or maybe separated and Two FAQs be made one on technical help and another on "What is goth?"

Just some ideas...and I hope that makes sense.

I think the structure is perfectly fine. The real problem seems to be that some people don't take the time to look around and actually READ anything. The people who run these boards shouldn't have to re-arrange things just because a minority of posters are stupid.

-N

I have to agree. 95% of us managed to find things without having it fed to us on a platter. The dross will just fall to the wayside regardless.

It's not difficulty, it's laziness. A plague that seems to be widespread, IMO.

I'm just wondering...How come the general board is so low and not on the top? Just wondering. Most message boards I've been to, the General Section is on that top. Thats what I was thinking was the problem, as many people have been accustomed to that, I suppose.

Most forums arrange themselves to have technical questions about the site and moderator/admin areas and feedback forums on top. The reason why there is a message board here is because it exists for and about goth.net first and foremost.
The flotsam of the General Discussion and specialised discussion forums are usually placed underneath the technical boards so that the general fluff does not appear to predominate the board. The importance, not traffic of the forums, is the determinate in terms of placement.

If a member is not intelligent enough to scroll down with three or four neuron paths firing in their brain to do so, then they probably don't have the brain power to post intelligently anyway, and frankly, we don't want them. This board gets many many applicants per day, and there will always be another 50 intelligent people who will scroll down and read for every moron that has ever posted something not site related on the goth.net board.






~blood rose~

Oh, I see. I was just wondering about that. Thanks for clarifying that. Is that the same reason why the FAQ is structured the way it is too?

yes.

Ok...thanks for clarifying things as I was curious about that from the start. I did however scroll down as it is in my nature to. You should put a big sign saying SCROLL DOWN STOOPID. Hehe. That might work. :p (: But maybe this is a better method of clearing out the stupid people.

Lady Morticia thought it was human instinct to scroll down. X)

Well, the thing is, there's a reason why each forum section has a little explanation in the square... like GOTH.NET: "A place for notices and discussion regarding things about the domain, the site, the forums and the services." and HELP: "For people who need help with any part of GOTH.NET, from the web site, to the forum, to how to change your password, and anything else that's vexing you." etc.

I'm not sure how much more I need to spoonfeed this stuff to people... the sections have titles and descriptions that explain what goes on in the section, and I believe that the descriptions are generally fairly self-explanatory and clear. If they still can't make it into the right sections and are too lazy to scroll down then I'm inclined to feel they deserve to get flamed.


With the FAQ having the more technical questions asked before the Gothic questions is mainly because as Rose pointed out it exists first and foremost to be for and about goth.net. Secondly, the most frequently asked questions that PreZ and I see in our inboxes deal with people needing help with their email/ftp/etc. and they're often the ones mostly easily answered in a faq answer. Here on the forums it's slightly different as to what are the most frequently asked questions ("am I goth?" "what is goth?"), but then many of the people with user accounts aren't forum members and many forum members aren't user account holders either. The FAQ services the site first and foremost and the general inquiring public second.


Lilith

And in some cases they do scroll down but just without reading all the relevant information above... as evidenced with the sign-up emails. There they just skip all the text at the top and scroll down to find the link they've been told to click.

Clicky-clicky for a recent example posted midway down the page.

Selective reading, such joy. So yes sometimes it's human nature to scroll down but it still doesn't help things.


Lilith

Lilith,
Is it plausible to screen each individual e-mail asking why they want to join Goth.net? If they answer in leet, gibberish, or chat style you return a message saying shape up before you can join the forums. There are other ways of course like making it require a little intelligence to apply.
Or aha have a short quiz on the rules before someone joins. Where they have to answer correctly. Even if they cheat, they still have to look and read the rules!!!! Its madness I tell you madness!!! Muahahahahahaha



Zwei~Amazed at my own wit

Zwei, consider the amount of extra work required by Lilith in order to implement such a system.
In the general run of the things newbies aren't too much of a hassle. It's really only the big waves when things start to get out of hand.



Doth, adding 2c

I think we're taking this newbie thing out of proportion. Sure, they can be annoying. REALLY annoying. And sometimes they come in swarms. In all honesty, the start of this month and the end of June was the worst swarm of newbies I have ever seen here, even beating out the group of fools in late October 2002.
But we shook off the July wave like a bd case of fleas and when the board settles down to a routine, like it is now, it is very productive around here. I don't think that changing the way the boards are run to either accomodate or expunge stupid people is any way to run a board. I say let them come, we've more than enough people to sort them out verbally.

In a word...

No

There are generally a few applications a day, I seriously don't have the time or the inclination to sit around quizzing people about why they want to join up... it's much easier to just ban the idiots and keep going than to screen every single one. Especially when of those that sign up about 80% never actually start posting anyway.

Also as Rose said, it's really not that bad either. Usually it's only a couple of people who are noticeable because they're so "vocal", but it's not every single newbie all the time that's being annoying.


How about you start paying me a nice wage by the hour so I can take the time to do this? That would be the only incentive I could have to spend that much time giving newbies the third degree and an extensive IQ/EQ test.


Err... yeah. Sure.



Lilith

Not quite fair to take that out of context don't you think? :p

While sure its impractical, it's a good idea to quiz them. The prelim e-mail thingy was just a kind of creative thinking. If you noticed I came to a sudden realization in the middle of my post where I stated that they would have to read the rules before applying. It was just an idea anyway.



If I had the money I would pay you and PreZ just to keep the site open but as it is I don't have that kind of cash. ???



Sure one could do it that way, but I just gave out an idea that might free up the boards from stupid and lazy noobs. I am just trying to help here. If you feel its easier to deal with them that way thats fine I can see why (Doth makes a good point).

Oh and you'll have to forgive me I can be quite eccentric at times.





Zwei~I guess I seem funny only to myself, although it probably would you help to know what I'm thinking about when I'm writing a post