Ah, the Mallgoth, one of the biggest annoyances for the Subculture. Originally, Hot Topic was a gold mine for these Marilyn Manson-worshipping "Spooky Kids". However, since mid-2010 Hot Topic started to change, the Tripp Pants had been replaced with Skinny Jeans, the black colored decorations began to vanish, it wasn't before long until the store has completely changed and became the spawning place of the "Scene Kids". It seems like the number of Mallgoths have diminished, drastically.

Now, most Mallgoths are posers and grow out of it within a year or two. Meanwhile some of them, including myself, actually begin to search more into the subculture including the history and music. Usually this ends up with the Mallgoth moving up to the next step, Babybat. Now Mallgoths almost being completely gone and replaced by the Scene Kids, it is possible that there will be even less young members of the subculture. On the other hand, there are some pros.

So do you believe that Mallgoths vanishing is a good thing? Or a bad thing?

Big suburban shopping malls seem to spawn a subculture of their own. Maybe the mallgoths aren't "vanishing" –- maybe they're just evolving (or devolving) into the latest consumerist fad du jour. (Cheers to you, Seth for getting more into the history and music of the subculture!)

I'm kind of neutral as to whether the vanishing of mallgoths is a good or bad thing, as I don't have anything to do with them -- or suburban shopping malls. My kind of goth kids hang out at the public library (attending Young Adult programs, or just meeting up and chatting, as well as checking out books and media).

-- Nephele

I don't and haven't paid attention because I rarely go to the mall. I rarely go to the mall because I think I'll be mistaken for a mallgoth and I dislike that label enormously...but I guess a plus would be at least people know I'm goth. That stereotype of me when I'm in the mall isn't helped by the fact that the only store I really like is Hot Topic because they carry my black nail polish and lipstick...

Kind of unrelated, but still relates to what Midi said, the one thing I find negative about the moniker "mallgoth" is that it seems to assume that real goths avoid malls and don't hang out at them... but I shop at the mall. And I sometimes hang out at them with my friends (who, mind you, are not goth). The mall - or a "commercial center" in some dialects - is a social gathering place, not specific to one type of person.... unless it's one of those malls that cater to people who have the money to spend $15 on a plain camisole. So, yeahhhhhhh... That's all I have to say. :/

^^^^
A quick google leads me to believe that while $15 might be expensive for a camisole, for any item of men's clothing I'd be pretty chuffed to find it that cheap here.... :sadface:

We didn't quite have the same kind of thing here, but the tone of teenaged rebellion has definitely changed in the last few years.

Sorry, Carpi. I didn't mean to imply that "real goths" don't hang out at suburban malls, and I know the mall can be a likely place to meet your friends and stuff.

I don't do the mall thing (not even when I was a kid), because I guess I have the advantage of being able to get to a lot of interesting and unique little shops in New York City (like Trash 'n' Vaudeville, presided over by the colorful Jimmy Webb). I'm not anti-consumerism – I'm just pro Mom & Pop type stores.

And (as you know), I'm always pushin' da liberry.

-- Nephele

To be honest, I miss the older Hot Topic of the earlier 2000s. I got my first Bowie shirt there. My first Bauhaus shirt. My first Siouxsie and the Banshees shirt. Both of my Cure shirts. Yes, there was a time when I listened to Marilyn Manson frequently, but I don't recall ever thinking of him as "goth." To me, Hot Topic provided easier access to a lot of the "essentials." I wouldn't even have a fishnet shirt if it wasn't for that place! haha. Maybe when I first entered goth culture my freshman year of high school I was a mallgoth (heck if I know), but I feel like I've come a long way since then and at times Hot Topic was there to help out. Albeit not frequent, but it was still there. So, in this instance, I think Hot Topic was actually a good thing as were mallgoths. I don't personally care if the mallgoths think Manson is goth as can be. I know what goth means to me, the culture of it that I enjoy, etc. and that's all that really matters. And with or without the mallgoths, there will still remain this stigma against goths because people don't understand it. It often reminds me of one of my favorite Eddie Izzard clips (at the very end).

Admittedly, I don't go to the mall that much anymore. Since Hot Topic has gone to the hipsters, there isn't much for me there anymore. And I was never a fan of other stores in the mall like Forever 21 and such. Half of them I refuse to even go into. The last time I was at a mall here in Austin though, definitely didn't see anyone who looked to be goth of any sort, mallgoth or otherwise. But it could just be the goth folk are moving out because it's too flipping hot to parade around in black all day!

Nephele, I do agree with the sentiment on "Mom and Pop" stores; however, this assumes you live in a place with that mentality. In Austin, I know of a couple independent goth stores (haven't been to either, but I know they exist!). However, as far as I know, Houston has nothing of the sort (correct me if I'm wrong folks as I'd love to know of some good places to go in Houston). So, unless you're willing to take your chances on buying off the internet without being certain it the item will fit properly, things are a bit challenging. I must say, I am incredibly jealous that you're so close to Trash and Vaudeville!

Sadly, the Mom & Pop stores are dying out everywhere – in both our cities and our small towns. There are so many that I used to go to in Manhattan, that had to close not because business was bad, but because greedy landlords kept raising the rent on them until it just didn't pay to stay open in a physical store anymore. Some of my favorites were The Magickal Childe (books, occult items, and oddities), Village Comics, The Village Toy Shop, Religious Sex (clothing), Footlight Records (great place for the old vinyl records, as well as CDs). As I said in another thread, I won't miss the big Borders Books & Music chain, but I will cry if Strand Books in Manhattan ever closes.

Rogoth, have you been to Trash and Vaudeville? Religious Sex used to be right across the street from T&V. I really miss Religious Sex, and I hope T&V doesn't close someday, too.

I also think you get better service in the Mom & Pop stores.

-- Nephele
P.S. Eddie Izzard, love him, and that was a great clip: "At school I didn't tell kids I was a transvestite, because I thought they might kill me with sticks. 'Why? ' 'I dunno. He said a word we didn't understand. Anyone at Scrabble with it?'" lol

Unfortunately, I have not even been to New York. Way back when Fuse TV used to be pretty decent, I'd watch some of the shows that Mistress Juliya hosted and a couple talked about T&V. I've also watched a couple videos on youtube talking about the store and their crazy cool owner! Ever since I've really wanted to go to New York...if and only if to visit T&V, haha! (Okay, whenever I end up going, I'm sure I'll think of other stuff I'd love to visit)

And you're totally right. I think it's one major reason I love Austin more than Houston. Here the Mom and Pop places still exist and aren't disappearing as rapidly as they are in other cities. But, I will have to hit up the stores I'm thinking of sooner rather than later. Secret Oktober will probably be around for a long time, but the other one I've heard of may not because it's more a high end, fancy pants (AKA expensive) goth store.

If you come to NYC to visit T&V, you'll also want to check out the whole of St. Mark's Place (where T&V is located). It's probably the gothiest area of Manhattan – or at least one of the gothiest. I've been hanging out there since I was a teen. I guess that makes me a marksgoth instead of a mallgoth. lol

-- Nephele

I'm neutral. I'm secure in my identity as a goth now so I don't feel "threatened" at all by mallgoths. I started out as a mallgoth so I would be a hypocrite if I hated them the way some goths do. Where I live, Hot Topic was my one of my only outlets for goth and other alternative merchandise(I hardly shop there now since the one in my area act like they don't know if they want to be alternative or mainstream). Now, all I have is Spencers and Underground to shop at for most of my stuff whenever I go to the mall. Despite that, I still go to the mall instead of going full online shopping. I've surprisingly found a lot of nice things in mainstream stores.

Don't worry about it Neph, I wasn't referring to your words. ^_^ Though my haunt of preference would be the bookstore over a mall (even though there's a bookstore at the mall - only it's a Borders and it's going out of business -.-;;).

What I will miss is the good deals on band T's at Hot Topic, and the occasional accessory find. In our mall, we are fortunate enough to have Black Fly, however, which keeps it real...always has. I just hope they stick around.

Even with Hot Topic changed, I have not yet seen a decrease in the number of Goths or Emos hanging out at the mall. A typical Wednesday night, and the place is still crawling...guess that is the official night for these folks to go to the mall?

But that said, the whole sub-culture has always seen it's rise and fall. It comes to the surface, goes back underground...it does this every 5-10 years.

Do I detect a heartbeat of sorts for the Goth culture?



I know this wasn't intened for me but I wanted to say something anyway.

I don't feel 'threatened' by mallgoths. I just don't want the drama that comes with going to the malls and being mistaken as one. For me, the mall is a very trying place. I don't like crowds and most of the stores in the mall hold no interest to me. So when I go there I'm already uncomfortable because of the crowds. I espeically hate it when I go there and there are a bunch of teenagers, because teenagers can be cruel.

Now I can go practically anywhere and be fine with the looks and comments and shit, but the mall give gives me the creeps because I find nothing enjoyable about it. It comes down to preference more than anything, I guess...not my own security in my goth identity. In that I am extremely secure. I'd just rather avoid the bullshit in places that I feel have negative connections to me (aka. the mall and the in-laws.)

I understand your problem with crowds and that's why I'm so glad there are outlet malls(and the fact that you can't get lost there ). What exactly do those teens do? I usually try to ignore them or tell them to fuck off depending on how much they get on my nerves.

There's bullshit everywhere and I've learned the hard way(especially being black which is a big no no around here)that choosing to be alternative means I have to accept that people aren't going to agree with it. Still, I also try to avoid places that have just too much bullshit.