You know, I've never felt the need to hide before. This is the first time in my life where I've felt like I have to hide a part of me, and my fiance is telling me to stop worrying, and why start hiding now? I'm a very public pagan, because I want to educate people. Maybe that's easier when it isn't future inlaws?

Same for me. I have no problems being pagan and am very open about it. It is not something to be ashamed of and I embrace it fully. Yet there is just something about my in-laws (even after 6 years) that makes me feel extremely uncomfortable around them and because of it I find myself not being who i am around them because it is what i think is best for everyone.

I dont hide per say if someone asks i will tell them but i dont seek fights when its pointless i can fight every one in town and its not going to change a thing. so i just be me just toned down a little

Sometimes toning it down can make life easier though I am at a point I simply don't WANT to tone it down anymore...

On another note- is anyone doing anything for Lammas?

I have mandatory overtime so i cant get of on the first so i will have to do Lammas on the weekend sat the sixth its the best i can do. By the weekend i will have 80hrs this week. I wish i can do it on the first tho.

That's Sunday (August 1st) -- right? Midi, how do you celebrate Lammas? I read that the word "Lammas" comes from the Old English word hlafmæsse, which literally means "loaf mass" (it was originally a church holiday for the blessing of loaves of fresh baked bread, I gather).

So, what does the pagan celebration entail these days?

-- Nephele

Lammas is on the first, you're right. Traditionally (or so I gather from research) it is suppose to mark (give or take) the beginning of harvest. Mabon (which is in September) marks the end of the harvest.

Folklorishly speaking (again, from research) this marks the changing of the seasons, which is symbolized by the god losing his power and beginning to die (meaning that the days are growing shorter) and the goddess sees this and is saddened by it (longer nights and colder weather).

Of course, there are many stories, depending on what you believe, all of them meant to explain the changing seasons, etc...in relation to the gods.

As for me, I cannot really do to much for Lammas. I am thinking, since it is meant to mark harvest (bread, etc...) that I might spend the day baking bread and such with my kids and end the night with a simple ritual meditation. It could be a good day!

Ah, thanks, Midi! I just dug out an old copy I have of Starhawk's Spiral Dance, and I see that she refers to the holiday as "Lughnasad" (August 1): "This is the wake of Lugh, the Sun King, who dies with the waning year, the Corn King who dies when the grain is reaped..."

One part of the ritual (according to Starhawk) involves coveners each saying what it is that they fear, and channeling those fears into small figures made of bread which are then tossed into a fire, thereby destroying their fears.

Pretty interesting!

-- Nephele

That is interesting. I think I'll add that to my doing this year! Thanks Nephele!

I always focus on the fading of the light (since Lugh means Light) and take this as a time to let old hurts die. I usually bake something too, as part of my usual routine.

Just an odd thought-

You'd think, as Goths, we'd celebrate the fading of the light and the nights growing longer rather than seeing it as a loss (or the coming of loss) as it is known for. I've been cooking an doing all day and only just now sat down to rest. I hope its a good day for you, LaughingCrow!

Maybe an interesting project would be to create a "gothic paganism" system, with a new mythos to embrace our love of darkness. Perhaps we can even include some science aspects in it, as well. I like the idea of incorporating science experiments in place of mere ritual, to further our understanding and appreciation of nature. Science experiments can be fun for the whole family.

What's the next pagan holiday coming up, Midi? I think it's Mabon, celebrating the fall equinox. We can get to work on that one now.

-- Nephele

For those looking for inspiration for a "gothic paganism" there are actually a couple of authors who have attempted to create, or at least address, such a topic.

First, there is Konstantinos. You can find his the Nocturnal Witchcraft collection most anywhere, if not online. In fact, it's usually rather common. This includes his books Nocturnal Witchcraft and the Gothic Grimoire.

Another one is Goth Craft by Raven Digitalis. Honestly, from what I've read of it, it read more like Voltaire's What is Goth? with a dash of Wicca to boot. I didn't really like it much as a result, but that's a personal bias.

Outside of actually trying to put Goth in Witchcraft, there's the LHP material that can be rather dark. Not LaVeyan Satanism per se, but rather Luciferian Witchcraft. It's definitely inspired by LaVey, but it's another animal altogether with. There's also Setianism, and witchcraft based around Hecate (which always seems to have a rather darker tone than your general Wiccan practice).

Those are merely some that I can think of off the top of my head at the moment. There are a plethora of systems and approaches out there already, though there's always value in creating your own as well. Some chaotes like that idea, at least.

Thanks, Clash, for your reviews of the books by Konstantinos and Raven Digitalis! I have to say, I'm a little leery of any author calling him/herself "Raven" anything.

As for Luciferian Witchcraft being inspired by LaVey... Hmm. I can picture LaVey's cremated ashes spinning furiously, upon hearing that. The Luciferians that I have known view Lucifer as almost a Christ-like figure, or a Prometheus – a helper and enlightener of mankind. LaVey's Satanism is really more about being a helper of yourself, and enlightening yourself. Satan stands in not as an actual being, but only as an archetype of mankind's basic desires.

As I mentioned above, I'd personally like to see some science incorporated into pagan rituals. That is, acknowledgment of the festival of Mabon and the turning Wheel of the Year by focusing on what actually happens during the autumnal equinox: The sun crossing the celestial equator and moving southward in the northern hemisphere... The time of the year when the length of night and day are nearly equal. The atmospheric refraction that makes the sun appear higher in the sky. I'll have to check my public library to see if there are any cool science experiment books that deal with the different seasons of the years, and contain simple experiments to illustrate what happens as the seasons change.

Even just taking kids outdoors at night and pointing out the constellations that appear in the autumn sky, like Andromeda and Cygnus, and recounting the myths associated with them, seems like a pretty cool way to celebrate the autumnal equinox.

-- Nephele

Science experiments, me likes! Your right, the next one is Mabon, Nephele! And I have been considering putting my own twist to think in order to incorporate more 'gothiness' to it all.

Clash- I've read (and own) the Konstantinos books and they are quite good. I also have read the Goth Craft book and I must say it has been my favorite so far- though it honestly didn't really say anything I didn't already know- but it brought me knew ideas and gave me different ways to view things- like how to incorporate magic into applying gothic make-up...

I haven't read read the other material mentioned, but I do believe they might well be worth checking out. I know that a great goth pagan band (and the only one I have been able to find) is Inkubus Sukkubus and a lot of their songs revolve around Hecate.


Nephele: As for you comment on your weariness of someone calling himself 'Raven'... would it comfort you to know that he is (one of) Anna Varney's greatest friend and adviser? Incorporating more science into is definitely something i would love to do!